Ethnicity Testing- Is it really worth it?

[peter]

It seems everyone is Irish on Ancestry DNA Peter! I agree, it could have been very misleading to me if I'd been a beginner in family history.

I have over 7,000 people on my tree and not one blood relative is Irish. I wonder which part of our DNA they are reading as Irish? I do have a fair bit of Somerset/Dorset Ancestry and that is close to Wales - are they reading some of the South West of England as Celtic, then assume that is Ireland?

There are two things that anyone looking at Ancestry's Ethnicity Estimates needs to be aware of - first of all, they describe them as relating to "Thousands of years ago", so whether they're right or wrong they're telling you about a time which is well beyond the reach of any records.

Secondly, the areas are large and overlapping. For example, the percentage described as Ireland relates to an area which includes not only the whole of Ireland, Scotland and Wales, but also a sizeable chunk of England. Great Britain includes parts of continental Europe, Europe West includes most of southern England.

 

[FamilyHistoryGal]

It may be over a thousand years ago; but to lump huge areas together like that doesn't make for satisfactory results. I know they state all this (I've read it) but it still seems like astrology rather than DNA. Lumping huge areas together just seems to make it all a muddled, non defined mess.

 

[jorghes]

There is also instances of emigration between Scotland and Ireland - as I have evidence of in my tree.

 

[peter]

It may be over a thousand years ago; but to lump huge areas together like that doesn't make for satisfactory results. I know they state all this (I've read it) but it still seems like astrology rather than DNA. Lumping huge areas together just seems to make it all a muddled, non defined mess.

Now perhaps you can understand why - until Living DNA came along - I described ethnicity estimates as being for amusement only?

There is also instances of emigration between Scotland and Ireland - as I have evidence of in my tree.

Take a look at the regions that Living DNA use in their analyses.

 

[FamilyHistoryGal]

Hi Peter,

Yes, I find some Living DNA regions easy to understand such as Cornwall, Devon, East Anglia, Lincolnshire, etc, but when you get to South Central England, South England, Central England and even South East England, I want to know which counties they cover. I got my husband to do a chart for me to understand it better. I was really pleased with Living DNA's analyses; but I would have loved a personalised colour coded map to help me understand these less clear regions.

For example. I have lots of Somerset and Dorset ancestry, so to understand it better I added my South England results to the South Central England results and that seemed to portray an accurate reading of both counties. This is the colour coded map I obtained from a blogger friend of mine, but Living DNA doesn't supply them. I've just asked by email and to complain that I haven't received my book! They told me to go on Google Images for the map. Lots of maps on Google Images but not this one. I looked on first page of Google Image results.

Living DNA Regional Results

 

[peter]

Your link just took me to the home page (no regions).

That's right - there is no URL that goes direct to the relevant map, so I thought the home page was as good a place to start as any. It also helps to put things in context because Living DNA offers more than one take on ancestry.

If anyone hasn't figured it yet: starting from the home page, just scroll down to Family Ancestry and click Find out more. Scroll down again on the next page until you get to the map and click Britain and Ireland. The map shows all of the regions whereas a set of results only shows the ones that are relevant to that individual.

Don't expect the boundaries of regions to coincide with county boundaries - it's generally geography that determines migration patterns.

 

[FamilyHistoryGal]

Hi Peter,

I got a green shaded map; but what I want is a colour coded map that is the same colours as my regional results. I know they won't be exact but better to have the regions separated out in colours than a huge splodge of green. East Anglia in Orange, Southern England in Dark Green, South Central England in mid blue etc. I've suggested this to Living DNA but they seem to think the green splodge map is what I'm after, I'm not.

 

[peter]

I don't know where you found the green splodges, but the map I've been talking about is colour-coded and there's a key underneath.

The only map I can find with just green splodges is when I look at my own results (because I'm 100% British Isles). I can turn that into a colour-coded map by clicking the + symbol, but of course it only shows the regions relevant to me (unlike the map I referenced previously, which shows all the regions).

 

[FamilyHistoryGal]

The green splodge map is before you click the + sign on the Regional Results. I wish you could see that colour coded map even before you click the + sign because the green splodges aren't very informative

 

[peter]

The green splodge map is before you click the + sign on the Regional Results.

Yes, that's exactly where I found it.

I wish you could see that colour coded map even before you click the + sign because the green splodges aren't very informative

Remember, not everyone who tests with Living DNA has only British/Irish ancestry, so defaulting to the sub-region display wouldn't work for everyone.

It's not a big deal to click on the + symbol, surely?

 

[FamilyHistoryGal]

Did you order a book Peter from Living DNA? I was hoping the colour coded map would be in the book.

You have to do seven clicks on the website to see that colour coded map alongside the Regional Results.

 

[peter]

Did you order a book Peter from Living DNA? I was hoping the colour coded map would be in the book.

I'm told the books are quite nice but I didn't order one (it's presumably not going to give any more information than is on the website, and the information on the website will be updated over time, so the book will become out of date).

You have to do seven clicks on the website to see that colour coded map alongside the Regional Results.

Does it really matter how many clicks it is? You only have to do it once.

 

[FamilyHistoryGal]

Hi Peter,

I take your point. However, I have 4.7% Scandinavian Ancestry and Scandinavia is huge on the map, all coloured in pink, which makes it look like I have a huge amount of Scandinavian Ancestry. Whereas the country I'm interested in (UK) I can barely make out where one colour starts and one ends, yet I have 92.3% UK ancestry. I just wish the UK colour coded regional map was bigger and Scandinavian one smaller! I suppose what I'm saying, I wish they could personalise it a bit more (hope the book might do that but not holding my breath)

It was a bit of a nuisance doing seven clicks because that is the map I'm most interested in. Now I've saved it and printed it out so I can refer to it without doing clickety click seven times!

Only have to do it once? I can't remember those regional results in my head!

 

[peter]

Now I've saved it and printed it out

If you use the Share option is creates a link to your results, then it's only one-click to go from the Regional display to the Sub Regions. Of course, my own sub regional map isn't so small-scale, because I don't have an Scandinavian ancestry (at least, not in the relevant timescale).

It sounds to me that what you would really like is a zoomable map of your sub-regional ancestry - maybe that's something they'll offer in the future. But for the time being, why not use the map that I originally mentioned?

 

[FamilyHistoryGal]

Hi Peter, I've found the bigger map and printed it out and put asterisks on the regions that pertain to my ancestry - thanks!

 

[Bob Spiers]

Of course if in doubt of your Irish ancestry you can always join 'MyHeritage' where you will learn you are distantly related to Saint Patrick and be contacted by a Bubba O'Docherty in the USA who will assert he is the many time great grandson of the Saint. (I am being facetious of course, but reading these postings brings back bad memories of similar contradictions of interpretation). On second thoughts, for peace of mind, stay as you are.

 

[FamilyHistoryGal]

I think everyone in the USA wants to have Irish origins! I have nothing against the Irish but to be told I have 36% Irish Ancestry when I've not found one Irish ancestor seems to be stretching it a bit. Yes, I know these results go back thousands of years and that many areas are all lumped together, but it still seems off course to me. My husband got 74% British Ancestry on Ancestry DNA so I'm expecting his Living DNA British results to be through the roof when they arrive - something like 110% British Ancestry perhaps? Via Living DNA my British Ancestry went to nearly 100% (92.3%) from Zero on Ancestry!

 

[Rhian]

Reworking the 'dog ate my homework' story, the dog chewed my test swab, my results show me as 50% Irish setter.

 

[Bob Spiers]

the dog chewed my test swab, my results show me as 50% Irish setter.

I liked that Rhian not least because the Irish Setter bit has special resonance. Our (late) Irish Setter (Jasper) as a puppy was renown for chewing his way through many things, including: a plastic butter carton (avec beurre which he part ate with diarrhoeic effect); a box of soap powder (powder left on the kitchen floor after attempting to lick and eventually making him sick); pulling a 13 amp power plug from the wall by tugging on the cable and chewing through to the inner wire,(thank goodness he pulled the plug first); umpteen plastic flower pots which he found inside the Greenhouse and sandal straps from my wife's discarded sandals. (She -ever resourceful - managed to get the local shoe repair man to stitch them together). In the end I had to build him a kennel and erect a wire compound (complete with a plaque 'Jasper's Pad') to which he was reluctantly led whenever we had to leave him at home. The love of our life but thank goodness when his puppyhood days were over.

 

[jorghes]

I think everyone in the USA wants to have Irish origins! I have nothing against the Irish but to be told I have 36% Irish Ancestry when I've not found one Irish ancestor seems to be stretching it a bit. Yes, I know these results go back thousands of years and that many areas are all lumped together, but it still seems off course to me. My husband got 74% British Ancestry on Ancestry DNA so I'm expecting his Living DNA British results to be through the roof when they arrive - something like 110% British Ancestry perhaps? Via Living DNA my British Ancestry went to nearly 100% (92.3%) from Zero on Ancestry!

Ancestry quotes my "British-ness" at 66% (part of the reason that I was so surprised by my initial results) - so I am still looking forward to seeing what comes from it! (My mother's is listed at 70%)