Reader’s question: GRO indexes

[JohnB]

I was unable to find a death on GRO that was easily found at FreeBMD just yesterday,
so I was very interested to read Peter's explanation of a possible reason.

However, when I checked on other deaths on the same page I found all of them easily at GRO.

So I am wondering what to do next, as Peter does not mention this situation?

STUBLEY John Bradford Yk. 23 101

 

[peter]

It's probably a mistranscription. Unfortunately - despite my constant requests - the GRO won't allow searching without a surname, even if the full index references are given.

Have you reported the error/omission to the GRO?

 

[Sue_3]

I had the same problem just over a week ago. I have invested £12.50 in the hope that the local Register Office can find the death registration for me, having given them all of the information I have, including the FreeBMD reference. I'm looking for my close relative's direct ancestor (hence my choice to invest) and I have no certainty that the registration will be the correct one, but it is the only one that might fit. I haven't reported this to the GRO as yet and I also haven't, yet, checked whether the other entries on the same page are in the new GRO Index. When I hear back from the Local RO I'll check and report accordingly (if they can't find it, it might be an error in the old GRO Index?).

 

[peter]

including the FreeBMD reference

Unfortunately that won't help them - it's an index to the GRO registers which are organised very differently from the local registers.

 

[JohnB]

I have reported it now, with suggestion it's probably a mistranscription and comment that others on same page were showing with no problem.
I tried all sorts of other spellings of Stubley with no success.
Yes, the option to search without a surname, on just Vol and Page would help but maybe they cannot display more than one record?
I'll let you know if it gets fixed.

 

[Sue_3]

Unfortunately that won't help them - it's an index to the GRO registers which are organised very differently from the local registers.

Yes, that’s true. However the form specifically asked for the FreeBMD reference, if you couldn’t supply a Lancs BMD reference, which I couldn’t because they haven’t yet included all death indexes for the relevant District on Lancs BMD. I imagine it’s so they can check where you have found the information and that you have given them the right year, quarter, and District as well as the name as shown in the index (the ones shown in the original GRO index referenced by FreeBMD as well as in the FreeBMD transcription)?

 

[Heather]

There are no Bradford Yorkshire deaths for 1842 listed on Yorkshire BMD.

 

[JohnB]

Thank you Heather. We are wanting to order a copy of the death cert and I believe we can only do that through GRO.

 

[peter]

Thank you Heather. We are wanting to order a copy of the death cert and I believe we can only do that through GRO.

You should always be able to order a local certificate, although it might be more expensive, and will probably be typed or handwritten, rather than a facsimile of the register entry (so there could be a transcription error). Best to check what you'll get before ordering - if it isn't going to be a facsimile, best to order from the GRO.

 

[JohnB]

Thanks for that advice, Peter.

 

[Sue_3]

I had the same problem just over a week ago. I have invested £12.50 in the hope that the local Register Office can find the death registration for me, having given them all of the information I have, including the FreeBMD reference. I'm looking for my close relative's direct ancestor (hence my choice to invest) and I have no certainty that the registration will be the correct one, but it is the only one that might fit. I haven't reported this to the GRO as yet and I also haven't, yet, checked whether the other entries on the same page are in the new GRO Index. When I hear back from the Local RO I'll check and report accordingly (if they can't find it, it might be an error in the old GRO Index?).

The Local RO couldn't find the death registration and have refunded my money. This likely indicates an error in the original GRO Index? However, I checked all of the entries on the same page and another one was also missing from the new GRO Index, so I have reported both inconsistencies to the GRO.

 

[peter]

The Local RO couldn't find the death registration and have refunded my money. This likely indicates an error in the original GRO Index? However, I checked all of the entries on the same page and another one was also missing from the new GRO Index, so I have reported both inconsistencies to the GRO.

Errors in the quarterly indexes are rare, and if only two of the entries on the same page are missing from the new GRO index it can't be part of a large block of missing entries. It's more likely that the two surnames have been badly mistranscribed and, if this is the case you may find that other entries from same sub-district (but on different pages) are also missing.

 

[JohnB]

I have reported it now, with suggestion it's probably a mistranscription and comment that others on same page were showing with no problem.
I'll let you know if it gets fixed.

My reported "Missing entry in the death index" still shows "Awaiting Investigation" after 33 days - although the GRO help page states "All error reports will be investigated within 10 working days"

 

[G6JPG (John)]

My reported "Missing entry in the death index" still shows "Awaiting Investigation" after 33 days - although the GRO help page states "All error reports will be investigated within 10 working days"

Suggests they don't work very often.

 

[jorghes]

I just went and searched for the record to have a look, and perhaps they forgot to tell you they fixed the problem?? Is it just me or is that the record you're looking for? (second from the top)

 

[Heather]

What is an "Occasional Copy " I've never seen that before.

 

[ChalfontR]

An Occasional Copy is one submitted to GRO other than as part of the usual quarterly return process - usually, but not always, would indicate a correction of some sort made to the entry.

 

[peter]

From the LostCousins Newsletter 9th December 2016:

New GRO indexes: what is an 'occasional copy'?
If you've been frantically making use of the new online indexes of births and deaths you'll probably have come across the wording 'occasional copy' in the search results. I had a shrewd idea what this might mean, but rather than guess I invited the GRO to provide an explanation:

These are going to be instances where the original registration has been amended in some way, requiring an “occasional copy” to be sent to the Registrar General (ie to supersede the original Quarterly Certified Copy).

They won’t be late registrations, which would be sent in with the Quarterly Certified returns for the relevant quarter.

Family historians being inquisitive souls, we inevitably wonder what change has been made - so I also asked whether it would be possible to obtain a copy of the original entry:

If a change has resulted in a re-registration of a birth, the new entry effectively supersedes the earlier one. The earlier entry remains in the index, but would have to be identified in the usual way and a copy of that earlier entry specifically ordered.

GRO would routinely issue the latest entry unless the customer specifically requests and references the earlier entry and if the earlier entry was provided, GRO would enclose a covering letter stating that this Certificate cannot be used for Official Purposes.

I'd be very interested to see any examples of such 'certificates' - do let me know if you manage to get hold of one!

 

[ChalfontR]

Peter

That answer confuses "Occasional Copies" which are almost always related to corrections, and "Re-Registrations" which are something else entirely and not connected with occasional copies at all.

I have lots of examples ( of both).

 

[peter]

That answer confuses "Occasional Copies" which are almost always related to corrections, and "Re-Registrations" which are something else entirely and not connected with occasional copies at all.

I posted the article as it was published in 2016 - it's possible that in paraphrasing my questions in order to focus on the GRO's response I may have inadvertently introduced an element of confusion.

There are the original questions I posed to my contact at the GRO on 7th November 2016:

Several people have asked me about the meaning of 'Occasional Copy: A',
'Occasional Copy: B' etc. As far as I can see these are entries that have
previously been indexed with a suffixed page number, eg 473a - and in at
least one of the examples I looked at it was an amended registration. Will
that always be the case, or might they be late registrations?

As you can imagine, when there is an amended registration there is great
interest in what the amendment was - however I know that in the past when
people have ordered certificates they've only been able to obtain the final
version, perhaps because this is the only one in your new indexes. Is there
a procedure for finding out what the nature of the amendment was?