Victorian BDM "uncertified" certificates

[jorghes]

Just to clarify, the "uncertified version" is simply a copy of the page of the register in which the event takes place. Unlike the UK, they don't focus simply on the individual record, unless its a newer record, where deaths and marriages were recorded on single pages.

Otherwise, there are 5 entries for births and deaths and three entries for marriages on each double page spread.

Happy to share examples if anyone is interested!

**I always recommended Australia certificates, they are full of useful (if not always truthful) information!

 

[peter]

Unlike the UK

You mean England & Wales. Scotland also provide a complete double-page spread from the register (and they also include more information in the entries, although the amount of information varied over time).

Most entries for the whole of Ireland prior to partition are available free online, and again you get to see the whole page.

 

[peter]

Just to clarify, the "uncertified version" is simply a copy of the page of the register

Is the system similar to England & Wales, where the centrally-held registers are merely transcribed copies of the original local register entries? If so, can you get local copies and see your ancestors' signatures?

 

[At home in NZ]

Most entries for the whole of Ireland prior to partition are available free online

Not strictly true. irishgenealogy.ie has:
Births 1864 to 1919
Marriages 1864 to 1944
Deaths 1864 to 1969
At 1 Jan every year a further year is added.
for most entries you can see the full register, they look like the English Parish Registers.

Happy to share examples if anyone is interested!

Yes please, I have convict descendants and would love to see what is available.

 

[peter]

Most entries for the whole of Ireland prior to partition are available free online

Not strictly true

But it IS true - some time ago they added marriages from 1845-1864 (not shown in your summary, but reported in my newsletter), so the only registers not available are the birth registers for 1920 and the first few months of 1921 (partition took effect on 3rd May 1921).

 

[jorghes]

You mean England & Wales. Scotland also provide a complete double-page spread from the register (and they also include more information in the entries, although the amount of information varied over time).

Apologies! I did know that.

Is the system similar to England & Wales, where the centrally-held registers are merely transcribed copies of the original local register entries? If so, can you get local copies and see your ancestors' signatures?

There is only one set of registers as far as I know, those held by the states. I am not sure that local governments ever held the rights to record births, deaths and marriages - our division of powers across the three tiers of government can be a little strange sometimes. From a brief bit of searching, in Victoria the Registry was set up in 1853 and each district had its own District Registrar, who recorded births/deaths/marriages for the overarching registry, I don't think that these districts necessarily correlated to local government areas. I presume it worked in a similar manner in each of the other states, of course depending on the dates when the colonies were created.

As far as I know marriages went through the church first, and then to the registrar. For example my great-grandparents have a copy of a certificate of marriage with their signatures, and then the register entry does not have their writing on it but is instead written by someone at the register office.

As for seeing people's handwriting on documents, I think that it is a bit hit and miss. I don't think it can be guaranteed. I've attached a register entry which I think includes the informants writing in their own information in the first column of the second page. The most interesting thing about this entry though is my great-aunt (the bottom entry) was born in Waitchie, in country Victoria, which is over 4 hours drive (nowadays) from Northcote, where her birth was registered (that and the registrar on this document was a woman in 1915).

 

[jorghes]

Yes please, I have convict descendants and would love to see what is available.

Best thing about (most) Australian documents is the shear amount of information included. If you look at my great-aunts document (bottom of the register), you can see her parents, their birth places, their marriage date and all children that are older than my great-aunt Violet.

I'll find a marriage and death register entry too if you want.

 

[peter]

in Victoria the Registry was set up in 1853 and each district had its own District Registrar, who recorded births/deaths/marriages for the overarching registry

That sounds the same as in Britain - it would be surprising if the District Registrars didn't keep a copy so that they could issue certificates locally.

 

[jorghes]

That sounds the same as in Britain - it would be surprising if the District Registrars didn't keep a copy so that they could issue certificates locally.

I honestly don't know if you can access those - everything you search will direct you to the central Registry in Melbourne.

 

[At home in NZ]

But it IS true -

I quoted from a cheat sheet that sits beside my keyboard, last updated on 1 Jan 2020.

The years depend on the religion and I am under the impression that births later than 1919 are not included because of the 100 year rule, i could be wrong but there is nothing in the website that explains any of it.
This is a page from the website that lists the years.

Best thing about (most) Australian documents is the shear amount of information included.

I agree with that, both my parents died in Oz, one in Brisbane and the other in Perth. Although they are slightly different in other ways, me and all my brothers are listed in the death certs and seeing those made me understand the 75 or is it 100 year rule.

Thanks for the examples jorghes, I have a feeling I have seen similar, some time ago.
Now to find the discussion that tells me how to obtain them............

 

[jorghes]

Now to find the discussion that tells me how to obtain them............

Easy - go to this site here, search and purchase/download to your hearts content!

I can also drag up the other states’ record websites too if needed.

 

[At home in NZ]

I can also drag up the other states’ record websites too if needed

Thanks for the link jorghes and
Thanks for the offer, I don't know off hand which ones I will need, I just know I saw some deaths in Victoria in my tree the other day.
I'm sure I could find the other states as and when I need to.
Such a pity that the death records in Ancestry aren't accompanied by an image.

 

[TerryM]

I agree with that, both my parents died in Oz, one in Brisbane and the other in Perth. Although they are slightly different in other ways, me and all my brothers are listed in the death certs and seeing those made me understand the 75 or is it 100 year rule.

Here in Australia it is usually only about 30 years for DCs, 50yrs for MCs and 100yrs for BCs only, but each state can vary slightly. It is very likely you can find out the approximate age of living people through a DC.

In contrast, in Qld the true BC record of a sealed adoption from the early 20th century is not only unavailable to the adult involved during their life, their next generation (their children) are also banned from obtaining it, yet the certificate is likely to be available online after 100years to complete strangers! Fortunately modern adoptions and donor children have full rights to records once they turn 18 nowadays

 

[jorghes]

I might as well link them anyway. South Australia is the odd one, you can only see their indexes through the local family history society and can't get digitised copies of the register themselves, only a transcript. I have a subscription, so I can always help as I can see the full information off the index without needing to purchase a transcription.

NSW
QLD
Tasmania
WA
SA

The Northern Territory you have to contact the Registry (check the link here) The ACT's approach seems similar, see the information here.

All of them have different prices, and you can see different things on the indexes - on QLDs for instance, you can see the actual date on the index rather than just a year.

 

[At home in NZ]

I might as well link them anyway. South Australia is the odd one, you can only see their indexes through the local family history society and can't get digitised copies of the register themselves, only a transcript. I have a subscription, so I can always help as I can see the full information off the index without needing to purchase a transcription.

jorghes, you are a goldmine! Such help is enormously appreciated. I've clicked on all the links, they work fine except Victoria whis is 'experiencing technical problems'.
Many thanks.

 

[jorghes]

No problems. Try this one here for Victoria's, I may have handicapped you by sending you the link to the search itself.

Scroll down and click on the blue button below the "Discounted Certificates" subheading. Not sure why it's labelled that way!

 

[Heather]

jorghes, you are a goldmine! Such help is enormously appreciated. I've clicked on all the links, they work fine except Victoria whis is 'experiencing technical problems'.
Many thanks.

Try this link for Victoria.

 

[At home in NZ]

Try this one here for Victoria's,

That works a treat, thanks.

 

[At home in NZ]

Try this QUOTE]

Now I'm spoilt for choice!
Thanks

Edit: something is going wrong here

 

[Margery]

Most entries for the whole of Ireland prior to partition are available free online

Peter, how far do they go back? Looking for a birth around 1802. Always thought the family were Protestant but there seems a possibility they were Roman Catholic.